Last year i worked with a child who had Aspergers. He was angry and violent his response to not getting his own way being to hit who ever broke his rules.

He came to us following an exclusion, last chance saloon, and I came to realise that this was a child who needed to know why his behaviour was unacceptable i.e by knowing that and why he felt differently.

We had just begun on a programme called All About Me when his parents decided to move him to a full time Sepcial School (eight to a class etc).

I recently heard he is struggling and on the verge of permenant expulsion
which leaves me feeling so sad for everything we had begun to achieve.

Any success stories out there or feelings on the subject?

the parents must have thought or been advised that what they were doing was right at the time

is there no opportunity for him to move back into mainstream?

Not sure of tthe age your child was, I work with a y3 who has aspergers. He responded in much the same way, lashing out when confused/confronted. We have had a tough year but he has settled very well. He still has outbursts but they are less violent and much fewer.

I don't think it's a case of showing a child they are wrong more what is acceptable behaviour and why. We have had problems with the parents but I think that a lot of this is due to the difficulty of having to deal with your child being 'different'. I think they expected (hoped) for more from us. The are moving him to a special school but (having visited / talked with the staff) are expecting more than will happen.

If your child isolder then I expect he will need a lot more assistence, will be much harder to gte through to him. It is sad that he has not settled.

As the father of a daughter with aspergers I have a few comments.

Yes, I think many parents do expect too much. There also seems to be this attitude schools and those dealing with their children should have all the answers and be able to work miracles with their children. I also believe there is a certain amount of blindness among parents, no one knows our children better then we do, and just how troublesome they can be, but then expect you to be able to do much better.

But as a parent I also get a little frustrated having to have the same conversation with teachers, sen and others to try and help them cope with my daughter and to ensure she can get as much out her school life as possible. Often it is silly things, if she doesn't know where to sit she will panic. You need to be clear about what you are saying to her - for instance she was told in year 7 if she wanted to be in the debating team she had a place. Was then invited to a meeting where teacher told the students there were too many and if any weren't serious to go back to class. As far as my daughter was concerned she had been given conflicting information and walked out.

Without doubt our children need to learn some of their behaviour is not acceptable, but just as important there needs to be put in place alternative ways for them to express themselves. One teacher told her if something happens that she wants the teacher to know about to take a piece of paper out of the classroom and write it down, fold it in half and leave it on her desk. She will then deal with it.

There is so much our children 'don't get' hidden rules that everyone else understands and they have never been told. Within mainstream there are so many distractions, and it is so easy for something completely 'innocent' to set them off. Nor do they find it easy to express themselves, no matter how smart they may be.

Often this can result in my daughter mispercieving what is going on. I accept that for her it is real and upsets her but will work with the school to find out what actually went on.

One of the most frustrating things though is staff who express assumptions as fact. The silliest one was a ta who said she would often pray and hold her cross. By this time she had long stopped praying and had never worn a cross, which was actually her medic alert necklace. Silly but does nothing to encourage confidence in me as a parent in you.

So as a parent I guess I would ask for four things to be considered by anyone dealing with my daughter in school:

1. Routine - In primary school this is easier but in secondary school things can change fast. LET HER KNOW! in advance if possible. Otherwise explain exactly what is going to happen.

2. Communication - she will take what you say litterally, especially if she is unsure of the situation. Be precise, but also make sure she hears you. If you tell the class to wait somewhere she will wait, if she doesn't hear you telling her to follow she will continue standing there even though everyone else is walking away. Be patient and give her opportunity to communicate back to you. This may well mean waiting until she has calmed down a lot.

3. Dont Assume you know what is causing the behaviour. More then once listening to what has happened during the day it has been easy for me to see how seemingly unconnected things have led to a build up resulting in her losing it over something apparently trivial.

4. When she does lose it it is because she has lost any control over what is happening to her and around her. ie she can no longer cope for the moment. She is not good with confrontation and will see any attempt to communicate with her as confrontational. She enjoys drawing and talking about animals. It is quicker to deal with her by getting her back into her comfort zone then aggravating the situation. Above all when children like this do lose it don't take it personal, they are reacting to something that has happened not you.

Having said that our daughter is not physically violent.

Hi George, welcome back

thanks for that insight George, a lot of 'food for thought' for me to take on board

Hey G,

We were just talking about you t'other night... long time no see bud.

(sorry for threadjacking)

Thank you George, that's extremely helpful to me too. We have a boy in Yr 3 who it is suspected by most people although not officially diagnosed for various reason as having Aspergers. I don't actually support the child with any 1-2-1 time but I do help him from time to time & hear him read regularly and your comments will be very helpful to remember when he's having what the CT calls an 'off-day'.

My youngest son with AS used to hate going into a lesson at secondary, and then finding a cover teacher there. It might be a music lesson, but his geography teacher would be covering, and that just was not right! He used to manage to stay in that lesson, but would then need to go to the unit to de-stress afterwards. Apparently, it is not possible to tell him which teachers are away - and anyway, he is the only child who gets upset by unannounced changes (oh yeh...).

Since working as a TA, the one that I have noticed is teachers saying "Get your maths book out, and...no, not yet, when I tell you to" - but technically, they DID just tell the child to!

Thanks for your comments George.

My experience and understanding in working with children who have ASD
would agree with everything you say. I work in a primary school and the
boy I currently support has come through the system as a gun obsessed
5 year old with poor language skills and terrified in a school to a placid year six who can understand a joke....he even performed in the school concert and has friends who choose to play with him and not because they have to.

He understands himself. He understands what he can cope with, what upsets him and works hard. Last year he was very upset to see me receiving a swipe from the child I previously mentioned. He came to me
and said "How is ___ ? I used to be like that but I learnt that you can't do that."

He is now due to go to Senior School and we are due to meet with Senco
and Head of Year to organise a programme to settle him into the new school. ANy suggestions?

Hi Laminator Queen!

I worked with 2 ASD boys over the past few years and was involved with both their transitions from infant to junior school. Don't know if this helps, but here are a few things I did to help with all the changes coming their way:

1. Get a map of the school (could be one showing the fire exits on it) and highlight which class or year area he will be in. Also highlight the areas he's most likely to be using - hall, dining room, gym, toilets etc.

2. I asked the school if I could visit (on my own) and take photographs of pretty much everything - where you come in, the playground, the entrances to the school, the year group areas, dining room, reception, gym, hall etc. I also took photos of staff to provide my boys with some familiar faces - year group teachers, support staff, head teacher, secretary, caretaker. I put these photos on to disc for a slide show for all the class and a separate disc or photo album for the child to take home and look at as many times as they want.

3. A tour of the school after or before school when there is virtually no one there so the child can get used to the shape of the building without all the usual distractions and noise.

4. The class visit which I stayed for to provide a familiar adult. I did take a back seat role here though so the boys could get to know their new adults (teachers, support staff).

5. An additional visit to look round again and try and remember anything from the other visits. No pressure, just a few 'do you remember we did ..... here' or 'this is the hall, do you remember when we came last time...'.

Just wanted to point out that I did this all off my own back and received very little help or communication from the junior school in relation to either of the transitions for both boys. I ran everything past the SENCo at our school who basically said 'go for it' as if we hadn't have done something, time would have ran out for them and they would have started a new school in September with only 1 class visit and a whole heap of anxiety!!

Good luck, hope the suggestions have been useful!!

Some things to add to Singing Nuns list:

what happens/where do you go first thing?
what happens at registration time?
do they have a bell at class changeover time?
what do children do at break times?
what happens at lunchtimes - queue where? pay how? choice of food? eat where? play where? (may be option of quiet room)
what happens re: PE? Where do they get changed? where do they put their clothes? what happens re: showers?
What do they do with PE kit/instruments/bags/coats/books during day?
Where are the toilets?
Where will his locker be? Can he have one that is easy to access (eg: on end/top of block). What do you do if you lose the key? (I got a spare cut and his tutor kept it for him)
Get an old home/school book - look through it. Where do you put the timetable/homework/etc. It usually has the school rules in it too.
Practice using a timetable (getting round school).
Make sure he knows sometimes a teacher may be away and he will have a different teacher (this really upset my son)
Is there any logic to the room numbers? (eg: a maths floor where rooms begin with M..)
Colour code books/files/folder for notes and homework.
Does he need to take all his books home/to school every day?
Introduce him to the reception staff. Tell him if he needs any help to go there. Let them know he has asd.
What can he do if he gets stressed? Time-out card? where can he go?
Where do any messages go? (eg: board in reception area)
Are there any special induction activites/bonding day?
Write an "all about X" sheet and give one to each of his teachers in Sept.
Make friends with the Head of Year.

My son had three visits to the school as well as the usual induction day (two organised by me). On his first day, he was telling everyone else where everything was!

Ooh thanks Kaz E!! I forgot to mention probably the most important thing! A typical school day at the new school! Dur!!

Thanks Guys.

I currently support two different children (one morning and one afternoons - sometimes toether!) One child has a great statement review where the new school came in and told us all about how they would support this child. The other school did not attend however they didi meet briefly with class teacher last week about general transition and I understand a request for a variety of visits has been made.

The map, the timetable, the ringing bells etc are going to be major factors

I am in a fortunate position that my daughter joined this school last year and I have met the head of year several times. Will put to together a plan of action using your ideas and go to her for assistance.

Good luck with it all, I hope all goes well for September.

Never forget what a difference you make to these children. If you ever need reminding, we're always here!